Modified 1v1 Maps for Upcoming 1v1 Tournament

[PACO]

DM-Terra got some burn. The map was entertaining to watch but it might need some minor adjustments. I'm sure that Sonic/snky/bleh could give some better feedback after playing it. From a spectator's pov, I enjoyed watching both maps.

Sonic vs snky



Sonic vs bleh

[sLY]

Yesterday's Showcase Duels happened to Showcase just how terrible the Codex spawns are and why they were fixed.

http://www.twitch.tv/ownedwell/c/5164296

Dasnaksta got 4 frags in less than 8 seconds. Two of the spawn kills were legit (those spawns will remain in place). The second two were an unacceptable map flaw.

Go to 9:57 to see the two unacceptable spawns (that have been fixed/removed).

[sLY]

[mrgrins]

Are all the edited/new maps on our servers? Next weekend i'd like to see some more show matches and see some high level play on them. big thanks to everyone who played last weekend. I for one had a blast.

[sLY]

[KillEmAll]

try your netspeed at 11000 or 10001.
I will contact chickie poo to see what he can offer.

[RickJames]

[sLY]

I changed netspeed to 10,000 and it fixed it. However, I only have to do that on KEA's server. Is it a poor performing server?

[dasnaksta]

Following my match from yesterday and after hearing the comments from the shoutcasters, I felt like I should state my opinion on the modifications of the maps.
First of all, thanks to MrGrins, m3ss and PACO for shoutcasting matches yesterday, I truly enjoyed that and hope you do more in the future.

However, I felt that the comments from the shoutcasters were inaccurate regarding the spawns on Codex and that I should not have won with a 7 frags lead.

I watched the stream today and clearly nanm misplayed the spawns on some occasions, making me look as a "lucky guy who gets lucky spawns":
- The spawn kill at 9:57 could have been avoided if he didn't rush towards flak as a quick reflex on the heat of the moment.
- Then that "lucky spawn kill" lead into a quick "unlucky" spawn at armor that imo, could have also been avoided if he had dodged properly or piston even.
- The next spawn kill, it just happens, in all *&@*(#!@ games.

I have nothing against nanm, but whenever I used to play higher-skilled players in duel like flux or depain, these easy spawn kills barely never happened because they had a much stronger defensive/evasive game. nanm did not play passively but rather played aggressively on some occasions where he shouldn't have. The kill streak that I got was mostly due to errors on his part or my map knowledge.

I truly believe that modifying maps is not the solution. Pretending to "fix" maps, simply based on false assumptions, is NOT the solution. Even worse, running a whole tournament with modified maps that could change the whole dynamics of gameplay, and that have just been released a month before a tournament, is unacceptable. Except for Deck for course! Everyone loves Deck, right? This map does not need any modifications at all with its mini and pulse spawns that you are almost guaranteed of getting spawn killed. I have nothing against bleh, but of course he is going to be against if any changes occur to it, considering he has mastered the map and can play the spawns perfectly at the right angles. Deck can be abused as much as Codex can. Why not change Deck simply because of its popularity and familiarity and change Codex because you've seen someone get 2 spawns kills, which happens on Deck all the time. Everyone loves Spheres also, right? Where you know that your opponent is going to spawn at Pads every spawn.

About Liandri, ahhhhhh Liandri (dreams). Everyone knows I love Liandri. As I kept telling sLY, I do not know what is wrong with our North American community, but I have never seen a streamed game of Liandri at a world tournament of local tournament that was not intense. Liandri makes up for the best games. However, I totally understand the point of view of shoutcasters that a 1-0 game could be boring to shoutcast or watch. The proposed changes would make the map more than horrible imo, considering that it would put too much weight on that belt room. Moving the sniper to the redeemer room would give the guy spawning at belt a huge advantage having the belt and the most powerful weapon in the middle room. Reaching that sniper on Liandri was a challenge on its own when playing someone who controls the middle very well. Liandri was somehow a hitscan map already, please do not make it even worse.

With that said, I truly believe that ONE solution to the problem is to do what Quake 3 did years ago, i.e. implement a maximum of 5-seconds delay on spawns that could throw off the guy in control. The player of course, could use it only if he desires it, at his own risk of getting spawn raped. Having played Quake all my life, I do not give a damn about getting spawn killed, those still frequently occur in the latest FPS games. DM6 was never changed in Q3 despite the massive spawn raping in the LG room. The best games I have seen in this game are on DM6:

Must-watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LKV1WFkwRK8

Play as smart as possible, deal a lot of damage to your opponent before dying such that he cannot rush you to spawns. If you think you didnt do enough damage, be ready to run for your life or piston to get out of tricky situations. Not all spawns kills can be avoided. Accept it.
Keep in mind that if you can get spawn-killed, you can spawn-kill too. It works both ways. Learn how to do it yourself.
More importantly, learn how to deal with a game that was developed in 99, otherwise move on to another game.

I am ready for your comments sLY.

[KillEmAll]

[NoAimNoMoves]

[sLY]

[dasnaksta]

It appears as if I am the only one here against making changes to all maps. People are aware of my personality and know that I was and still am against any changes that was added to this game.

I was totally against the addition fast weapon switch despite making the game feel faster. It changed the play-style a lot allowing to take more risks in situations you normally wouldn't.

I did not mind the lockdown. Lockdown actually favoured my play-style as I have always been a pulse-mini addict and never been a strong aimer. Overpowered minigun was a true answer to people abusing hitscan weapons (shock/sniper). This game relies so much around those 2 weapons now, except for a few maps, which are usually not preferred by the community because people can't play shock/sniper-arena as they wished.
Unfortunately I have a feeling that maps like Terra and Spheres, that are heavily hitscan-based will be selected over stable maps that were played in tournaments for years like Turbine or Tempest. From a spectator-commentator point-of-view, it appears it is much more interesting to have a shock/sniper-arena game with 50 frags than a game of chess with 15 frags in total. Personally, I do not watch games to see who has the best fragging ability and who could make frag movies, but rather to see who is the smartest and can outplay his opponent because of his map knowledge and map control.

The only reason I proposed the delayed spawns is to "partially fix" the problem and to accommodate the community, considering that I am aware that I am an outlier in this community.

[mrgrins]

hi dasnaksta, All opinions are appreciated here and I don't think the maplist is final yet so any discussion about the maps will be weighed by PAco and the admins.

From me personally, plz don't take anything the commentators say as the end all or as anything too serious. I for one am just there for a good time and to see some great game play. I am definitely not a pro player and will miss many nuances of the game. I feel like sometimes I need to remind people the commentary is for entertainment and anything we say is to be taken lightly. Not aimed at anyone in particular btw i've had other players comment about what I've said in games before.

I would like to say I do prefer a slower paced game with flurries of action rather then a 50 frag slug fest. 15 frags as well seems a little high. I rather enjoyed the cat and mouse of the Terra duel. The traps and and mind games of taking armor + making sounds is quite interesting. Perhaps we as commentators need to illustrate that more.

I think that what most people would like to avoid is a 20 minute 1-0 that most remember from the last final. That was also a NN tourny so the game played different then as well. Not hating on NN just saying the maps no doubt flowed differently.

[RickJames]

Last 1v1 tourney was reg mrgrins. The best 1v1s I've seen ended with scores like 30-29 on deck. That's when both players are so aggressive and even that neither can establish control for too long.

[mrgrins]

O i was thinking of MLDM or whichever one i streamed last.

[sLY]

[sLY]

[sLY]

[blackout\\]

[sLY]

[Blue_Armature]

[dasnaksta]

Ridicule has always been your only argument sLY/blackout.

I never requested lock-down or fast weapon switch to be removed. Read above.
Despite not agreeing, I moved on and kept playing when the community included them.

I disagreed with newnet and decided to quit playing UT99 because it altered the gameplay and made the game entirely hitscan-based.

Making changes to most of the maps all of a sudden because you do not agree with how the game is played, despite having played them for 15 years, annoys me. Trying to force the community to play your modified maps in a tournament annoys me even more.

[z4TaN]

Where can dowload Deck-GUDM?
very good map!

[sLY]

[KillEmAll]

[z4TaN]

First Thanks for Pack KIllEmAll.

---
Although it may seem, I'm a player ONLY 1v1, and I would like to give my opinion.

DM-Terra:
This very well for my style of play, which is based on being defensive and accumulate life, which criticized me a lot my teammates, because becomes somewhat boring, but that's how I managed to win, since most of attacking people without thinking. (No offense to anyone) anyway I lose a lot and I'm proud of that, but back to the map, as I read, you are missing some changes to not be as easy to escape, one can safely terminate with 0 deaths against.

DM-Codex:
uuuuhh! This map, this map years playing with my old clan. And I do not think need to change, because as someone (dasnaksta I think) said, just waiting to be spawn, and not be hasty. In other words, play a little more intelligently, damaging your enemy so you can not be as aggressive after a death.

DM-Agony:
One of my favorite maps, like the previous one, because it is difficult to abuse the sniper here, no probe his version, but only remove life (+5) Armor 100 and ShieldBelt.

DM-Deck16:
Although it is one of the maps the best, but also abuse Sniper but the decrease in the sniper ammo is just PERFECT. when played this map on your servers, I run to add it to my server.

DM-Malevolence:
Even I did not try, but do not think need changes, the final tournament that I organize in August, was played here, and gave a show for the public.

DM-Liandri:
With respect, but the changes are horrendous, I again agree with my friend (? Dasnaksta. Having the shield and seated himself Sniper is absolutely INSTA LOSE. The only change I would conduct is remove one (1) shock ammo because from this point you can control ALL the map, and the first to take shield and shock can now grab a difference in deaths difficult to trace.

DM-Spheres:
They did with this map? they added music? honestly who plays competitively with music on?

DM-Curse:
I made ​​the mistake of adding the map in one of my tournaments and 1v1 was the worst mistake is not good map for 1v1, it's easy campear Shield area, as it has access to almost the entire map.

DM-Phobos:
Are you serious? No juge this map if it is not with bots simpleplayer tournament.

Ok, sorry for text, and my english, I helped to GoogleTranslate.
Original Text for dudes:(Native lenguaje)

[PACO]

I can see where sLY is coming from and I can see where DaSnaksta is coming from. I think all of us are purists to a certain extent but 15 years later, there should be some compromises. The game evolves but the changes should be organic.

[diff`lx]

I remember Terra being decent last time I played it a couple years back. If it's been polished up it could work.

The only way I can see Liandri being made more exciting without completely revamping it is to turn the portals into 'tunnel portals' that you can see and shoot through. And block off the redeemer room because it's useless.

Snakester's idea aint bad either

[sLY]